Jesus prayed we'd be 'ONE' with each other in Him that the world will know! (John 17)

Louie Giglio: How GREAT Is Our GOD — The Heavens Proclaim the GLORY of GOD! (But laminin doesn't support the false doctrine of once-saved-always-saved)

Transcription and summary by Jeff Fenske.

[Updated and expanded in response to comment #16, below (Apparently, the producers pulled the YouTube clips, so I watched it here in order to respond. Why would they do this? Is it about getting the message out, or the money?)]

“The Whirlpool galaxy…contains 300 billion stars…, and it is one of hundreds of billions of other galaxies in the known universe that God has made.”

[youtube=]Part 1

The sun [an average sized star] is a million times the size of the earth.

Betelgeuse, a red supergiant star, is twice the size of the earth’s orbit around the sun!

And the largest star, Canis Majoris, “the big dog star,” …. “If the earth were a golf ball, Canis Majoris would be the height of Mount Everest!

[youtube=]Part 2

“Sin has a way of shrinking God down in our minds and puffing us up in our own estimation. But just a glance into the universe that God has made resizes everything in a heartbeat. …

We are worshiping an unrivaled, uncontested God of all kind of might and power and glory and awe! There is none like Him, anywhere in all of creation!”

[youtube=]Part 3

[youtube=]Part 4

[youtube=]Part 5

“There are millions and millions and millions of microscopic crosses holding you together right now.”

Sadly (this is so sad—because what preceded this was so awesome!), Louie uses the laminin, cross theory to support what is Satan’s greatest deception—once-saved-always-saved, OSAS, eternal security, “I’m okay; you’re okay”—saying the exact opposite of what Jesus taught in John 15 (“If you abide….”) and what the NT writers say elsewhere: Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way | Who are the Children of God? — “There is therefore now *no condemnation* to those who are IN CHRIST Jesus, who don’t WALK according to the flesh, but ACCORDING TO THE SPIRIT.”
The CHIEF PILLAR of Eternal Security (OSAS) Toppled! addresses this passage directly.

Giglio says what Jesus clearly did not say, no matter what Matt Redman’s song says over and over and over: “You never let go,” each time it’s played on the radio over and over and over (Positive encouragement — K-LOVE). Louie Giglio concludes this message with these words:

“He said, ‘I will hold you. Even when you let go of Me I’m not going to let go of you.’ Did you know there are millions and millions and millions of microscopic crosses holding you together right now. And one, giant, glorious cross of Jesus Christ is holding everyone of us that’s trusted in Him onto the Heavenly Father — and holding the Heavenly Father onto us. And it’s going to keep holding us onto Him, that cross, forever, and ever, and ever, and ever. We will never not be carried by the strong hand of the Universe-making God. And He will bring us through. That is the promise of the Everlasting God, Amen.”

This is the unbiblical eternal-security teaching (once-saved-always-saved). But what matters is what the Word of God actually says:
We have freedom in Christ if we abide in Him.
That’s what the Word of God says. We shouldn’t base our theology on a certain physical characteristic of God’s creation. We should base our theology on what the Bible actually says.
“Trusting” isn’t enough; it’s abiding in Him that counts. “Hope” isn’t enough; it’s abiding in Him that is real Christianity.

“Those who are Christ’s have crucified their flesh” – Paul in Galatians 5.

We must abide in Him and have clear consciences before Almighty God.
What Giglio concludes from laminin is hogwash. If you doubt that, please read: Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way | Who are the Children of God? — “There is therefore now *no condemnation* to those who are IN CHRIST Jesus, who don’t WALK according to the flesh, but ACCORDING TO THE SPIRIT”. This is the rest of the story that mainstream preachers won’t preach. They’re basing their theology on Paul’s introductions, not his conclusions, as well as what Jesus and other New Testament writers clearly said.
Whatever happened to the warnings that are so prevalent in the New Testament? Positive encouragement — K-LOVE now carries the day. We’ve re-written the gospel to the degree that America is now on the verge of total collapse.

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of Heaven; but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.” – Jesus in Mt. 7:21

We’ve left our First-Love — as ‘Christians’ applaud the teachers who claim we never can — as they did here.
“This is what’s destroying America” — God.
Jeff Fenske
Give God Glory! How much energy does the Sun produce in a single second?
How much energy does the Sun produce in a single second?
Total Energy of the Stars in the Universe!
Scientists Find 200 Sextillion More Stars in the Sky — The new estimate is 300,000,000,000,000,000,000,000!
Star Size Comparison HD
Photo: God’s Universe: Our Milky Way–90° Panorama
Baruch: “Not only is DECEPTION of the church possible, it WAS PROPHESIED TO HAPPEN!” — Jesus said “IN THE LAST DAYS THE MAJORITY WILL BE DECEIVED, take heed that it doesn’t happen to you” — “FALSE TEACHERS are actually SPEAKING SPELLS with the words of their FALSE DOCTRINES!”


Alaska: R. T. Kendall, author of "Total Forgiveness" (a forgive-others-&-be-free book) will be speaking at Abbott Loop on Sunday


Abbott Loop podcast clarification


  1. Daniel

    I am confused. Are you in agreement with Louies message, or do you disagree?

  2. Jeff Fenske

    Thanks, Daniel!
    I added a few word above that should clarify that I think the majority of this presentation is awesome to the max! But then he brings in the deceptive salvation heresy that is commonly taught in the U.S. today, and is what I believe the number one reason our country is on the verge of extinction.
    It’s time to come out from them and be separate.
    If you’re interested in exactly what I believe on this subject, I have 20 posts in my “Who goes to heaven?” category, currently, which is in the categories pull-down menu, above right. And I specifically lay out what the Bible really does clearly teach about who goes to heaven in my “Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way” article.
    Thanks for asking, and helping me be more clear in this article!
    God bless!!!
    Jeff : )

  3. Jeri

    The verse Hebrews 10:26 is speaking about the people who have “heard/knows” what the truth is but did not accept Christ as their savior. Also told to us in 10:39 that we are not the same people being referred to in vs 26.
    Once you have accepted Christ as your savior your sins are forgiven past, present, and future. And you will have eternal life. You will still sin after you become a child of the King, because you are still of the flesh, and you need to confess your sins because unconfessed sin hinders prayers. Psalms 66:18 It is like talking to your best friend (GOD) knowing you have done something that is wrong and would hurt them, you would apologize to your best friend wouldn’t you? Isn’t it awesome to know once you have accepted him you are His forever, but I would be ashamed to stand before him doing things that have displeased him without owning up to it and telling him how sorry I am.

  4. Jeff Fenske

    Dear Jeri,
    Thank you for posting, but please look at this text again.
    Verses 29-30 show beyond the shadow of a doubt that the writer is referring to born-again Christians. I’ll bold the key parts.

    Hebrews: 10:26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remains no more a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and a fierceness of fire which will devour the adversaries. 28 A man who disregards Moses’ law [old covenant – ed.] dies without compassion on the word of two or three witnesses. 29 How much worse punishment, do you think, will he be judged worthy of, who has trodden under foot the Son of God, and has counted the blood of the covenant with which he was sanctified an unholy thing, and has insulted the Spirit of grace [new covenant – ed.]? 30 For we know him who said, “Vengeance belongs to me,” says the Lord, “I will repay.” Again, “The Lord will judge his people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
    32 But remember the former days, in which, after you were enlightened, you endured a great struggle with sufferings; 33 partly, being exposed to both reproaches and oppressions; and partly, becoming partakers with those who were treated so. 34 For you both had compassion on me in my chains, and joyfully accepted the plundering of your possessions, knowing that you have for yourselves a better possession and an enduring one in the heavens. 35 Therefore don’t throw away your boldness, which has a great reward. 36 For you need endurance so that, having done the will of God, you may receive the promise.
    37 “In a very little while, he who comes will come, and will not wait.
    38 But the righteous will live by faith [haven’t we heard this quoted from pulpits all over this land — but not with this warning that follows. This is called lying through omission. They usually omit this entire (10:26-39) passage, actually, choosing to only quote the Romans-1 version – ed.]. If he shrinks back, my soul has no pleasure in him.”
    39 But we are not of those who shrink back to destruction, but of those who have faith to the saving of the soul.

    Verse 39 is the positive note the writer ends on which doesn’t negate the rest of what he so clearly said. True, saving faith isn’t mere belief, but also position, right standing with Christ, based on obedience. Ie. verse 36: “having done the will of God, you may receive….”
    This entire text applies to born-again Christians, and is consistent with what the entire New Testament teaches when read without OSAS glasses and with a heart to understand the Author’s intent.
    But unfortunately, most American ‘Christians’ have been given the glasses, reinforced with prayers (James-3 curses) that we would believe the mainstream doctrine, and it’s often hard to get them off without prayer.
    This one text, by itself, completely disproves “once saved, always saved.” But there are many other texts which are also stand-alone debunkers, which I include in “Who-Goes-to-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the way.”
    We must, by God’s grace (the empowerment of the Holy Spirit) overcome. The new covenant is conditional just as the old covenant was. But we have a whole new standard now that the Holy Spirit lives in us. Now, Jesus says in Matthew 5 that hate is murder and lust is now adultery, etc..
    And he ends chapter 5 with this:

    43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor, and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who mistreat you and persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the just and the unjust. 46 For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Don’t even the tax collectors do the same? 47 If you only greet your friends, what more do you do than others? Don’t even the tax collectors do the same? 48 Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.

    The world is eagerly awaiting to see the real thing happen in us: Jesus’ call for us to be ONE in Him realized. Then the world will know. (John 17)
    We can do it!!!
    This doesn’t mean we never worry, procrastinate, etc.. But we won’t sin the sins in Paul’s who-will-not-inherit-the-Kingdom list in Galatians 5.
    Freedom when we’re truly in Christ!
    Jeff Fenske : )

  5. Jeri

    I will just leave you with these verses to 2 Timothy 2:14-19

  6. Albert Cooper

    Where can I view the sermon notes from Pastor Giglio’s “Great Is Our God” sermon? Anyone have any ideas?

  7. Jeff Fenske

    It’s likely there is no transcript out there. I transcribed these quotes myself.
    God bless!
    Jeff : )

  8. alnert cooper

    Jeff is it possible for you to forward me your full transcription? I’m preparing for a workshop and could greatly benefit from it. I’m running against the clock to transcribe it myself.

  9. albert cooper

    jeff, is it possible for you to forward me your transciption? I am working on a workshop that I would love to incorporate this tour. However, I am against the clock and just don’t have the time to transcribe myself.

  10. Jeff Fenske

    Sorry. I only transcribed what I posted.

  11. Kayti

    I know I’m a few months behind, but hebrews 10:26 says “if we deliberately keep sinning agter we have received the knowledge of the truth.”
    It doesn’t say that we have ACCEPTED the truth, or are born again. It plainly says, we have RECEIVED the knowledge. Which makes us without excuse for not accepting the gospel.
    If sin could pluck us out of the hand of God, what kind of power would He have? If we have to stop sinning to come to God, we’d all be so very lost. And hopeless. And we’d have to EARN our salvation. That’s exactly what’s so radical about Chrisitianity. Jesus’ sacrifice was a gift. Once for all. We deserved death, but He took it for us. Whether we keep sinning or not–cause, PS, we’ll always keep sinning. That’s MY Jesus. Not one that depends on us to stay in His hand, but holds us firmly in His loving grasp.

  12. Jeff Fenske

    Dear Kayti,
    In comment #4, above, please look closely at verse 29. The “willfully sinning after receiving the knowledge of the truth” people, spoken of here, had been sanctified by the blood of Jesus according to the new covenant.
    The writer is clearly talking to and warning born-again believers, and there are many texts like these in the New Testament that get hardly any pulpit-time, or air-time over radio and TV.
    The deception in the last days will be great, the Bible warns. And it really is!
    See: Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way. It’s all laid out what the Bible really teaches. The deception happens when parts of verses and chapters and books of the Bible are pulled out and twisted to mean something they clearly don’t, when the entire text is read.
    This happens over and over. It’s amazing how it’s been pulled off.
    Also, Jesus’ unable-to-be-plucked-from-His-hand illustration actually teaches the opposite of what is commonly taught, as Jeff Paton clearly points out here: The CHIEF PILLAR of Eternal Security (OSAS) Toppled!
    Those who can’t be plucked out are those who hear and obey (John 10:26).
    And you say: “If we have to stop sinning to come to God….” I don’t know anyone who teaches that. We have to repent, for sure. But until we are born-again and have the Holy Spirit in us we don’t have the grace (or the ability, the means) to stop sinning.
    Grace isn’t a license to sin, but the enablement to overcome sin, as we are led by and empowered by the Holy Spirit. We are promised that we will never be tempted above our ability to bear the trial. Right?
    Another clear example of how we’ve been deceived by pastors (who were probably deceived by other pastors) is the mishandling of Romans 8:1. “There is therefore no condemnation” for who? What does the rest of the verse say? And the rest of the chapter?
    Only “those who are led by the Holy Spirit are the children of God,” Paul says in verses 13 and 14:

    For if you live after the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are children of God.

    And those who aren’t under condemnation are those who are actually and experientially “in Christ Jesus.”

    “There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who don’t walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.”

    Rupert Murdoch’s NIV omits the last part, but it’s still in verse 4.
    Being that we’re in the last days in which God promised the deception will be great, It’s crucial that we research what the Bible really says for ourselves. For what is taught from most pulpits in America is a lie, based largely on the teachings of Martin Luther, who didn’t get it. See my “Luther Didn’t Get It” category for proof, if you’re interested.
    God bless you!
    Jeff Fenske

  13. “fill me with your spirit – lead me to your full blessing and reward”
    JOSEPH – po box 24 02 15 – wuppertal 42289 germany
    likes to hear from you !
    p.s.please send infos on christians living in communtiy where to
    take part with

  14. This is awsome! And sooo true. i hope tha t many more people will get to see this!!! god bless

  15. I first saw all three dvds at church in 2008. I felt so tiny :)How great is Our GOD!!!!

  16. Julia

    @ Jeff Fenske – I do not believe in “once saved always saved”. I have watched this sermon 10 times, and never once have I come away with the “once saved always saved”. Jesus will never let us go – we can choose to walk away – but that’s not Him letting us go, that’s us leaving. He is the glue that holds EVERY human on this planet together. No matter how many times we let go of Jesus’ hand, He is always there – reaching out to us to bring us back home. Your reasoning above is legalistic and pharisaical – are the things you refer to the goal we are to keep in sight? Absolutely. Will we be lost because we couldn’t do it? Absolutely not. If we were able to keep these things, then Christ would not have had to die. Justification is the work of a moment, Sanctification is the work of a lifetime. Does that mean that once we have accepted Jesus sacrifice for our sins we will never sin again? If it did, then John would not have written in 1 John 2:1,2 – “My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. AND IF ANY MAN SIN, WE HAVE AN ADVOCATE WITH THE FATHER, JESUS CHRIST THE RIGHTEOUS: And he is the propitiation for our sins: AND NOT FOR OURS ONLY, BUT ALSO FOR THE SINS OF THE WHOLE WORLD.”
    Also, the most famous verse from the Holy Scriptures, the whole concept of which, unfortunately, is rarely is quoted in it’s entirety – John 3:14-21 – “AND AS MOSES LIFTED UP THE SERPENT IN THE WILDERNESS, EVEN SO MUST THE SON OF MAN BE LIFTED UP: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. FOR GOD SENT NOT HIS SON INTO THE WORLD TO CONDEMN THE WORLD; BUT THAT THE WORLD THROUGH HIM MIGHT BE SAVED. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.”
    Does this mean that when we accept Jesus we are able to immediately stop sinning? No. But we no longer want to sin and we begin to see.
    [NOTE: To truly understand ANY part of the New Testament, we must use the Old Testament, and understand what is being referenced – the only Scriptures available to Jesus and His disciples was the Old Testament – and the Bible must be used to interpret itself. On that note, here is the story of the serpents from Numbers 21:4-9 – “And they journeyed from mount Hor by the way of the Red sea, to compass the land of Edom: and the soul of the people was much discouraged because of the way. And the people spake against God, and against Moses, Wherefore have ye brought us up out of Egypt to die in the wilderness? for there is no bread, neither is there any water; and our soul loatheth this light bread (NOTE: this is referencing manna, which miraculously appeared every morning and would not last until the next day except on Friday, when it would last for Sabbath – the one day a week when no manna was on the ground). And the LORD sent fiery serpents among the people, and they bit the people; and much people of Israel died. Therefore the people came to Moses, and said, We have sinned, for we have spoken against the LORD, and against thee; pray unto the LORD, that he take away the serpents from us. And Moses prayed for the people. And the LORD said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole: and it shall come to pass, that every one that is bitten, when he looketh upon it, shall live. And Moses made a serpent of brass, and put it upon a pole, and it came to pass, that if a serpent had bitten any man, when he beheld the serpent of brass, he lived.)
    Please go to Numbers 21 and continue reading – you will find that even after all of the miracles that Israel beheld, they were incapable of not sinning – repeatedly God had to bring them back to Himself – they repeatedly let go, and He kept holding them in the palm of His hand, chastening and correcting them and bringing them back to the light. At the end of his life, even Moses, who had to wear a veil over his face because his face glowed with the light of the glory of God because he spoke with God in the sanctuary – was not allowed to enter the promised land because he sinned and in his anger smote the rock after God had told him to speak to the rock – which represented Christ, who would only die once for sin (Moses had already struck the rock to bring forth springs of living water – after which, he only needed to ask – and Moses completely understood the symbolism for he had been shown the heavenly sanctuary – and still he had anger management problems).
    SO . . . in all of that Jeff, I say – God is crazy in love with us and will do whatever it takes to save us – he will pursue us, and woo us, and forgive us – and He will do all in His power to hold onto us – but the greatest love is, that he will let us choose to walk away – but not without a fight, for every child that is lost breaks His heart. Once saved always saved? No – but He doesn’t let us go without giving all He has to keep us . . . He’s the star breather – and He holds us together – and if we choose, He let’s us go.

  17. Jeff Fenske

    I have updated this post to respond to your comment more completely. If you still think Louie isn’t teaching OSAS (once-saved-always-saved) by merely hoping and/or trusting in what Jesus did on the cross for us, then I’d like to see specifically where he did. I’ve more fully quoted what he actually said.
    It’s not wise to determine theology from a molecule, regardless of how amazing the molecule really is.
    This is my response to the New Testament scriptures you quoted, written by those who’ve interpreted the Old Testament for us.
    You quoted 1 John 2:1,2. That’s what the prodigal son parable is all about. He will run to us when we come back to Him. But why did you stop there? What about the rest of 1 John? Even just the next 4 verses:

    3 This is how we know that we know him: if we keep his commandments. 4 One who says, “I know him,” and doesn’t keep his commandments, is a liar, and the truth isn’t in him. 5 But whoever keeps his word, God’s love has most certainly been perfected in him. This is how we know that we are in him: 6 he who says he remains in him ought himself also to walk just like he walked.

    And in your John 3:16+ passage, you ended with verse 21,which is just one of the many verses that show that ‘believing’ in John is much more than just mental acceptance of what Jesus did for us on the cross:

    “But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his works may be revealed, that they have been done in God.”

    And add to that what Jesus said in verse 36 in this same chapter:

    One who believes in the Son has eternal life, but one who disobeys the Son won’t see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.”

    And add to that what Jesus said in John 15 about those who abide in Him and those who don’t. Abiding in Christ should be the emphasis. “Even the demons believe and tremble.”
    And you capitalized ‘condemn’ in John 3. Please consider what Paul really said about condemnation in Romans 8:1-4. And who are the sons of God, really, in Romans 8?
    This is all in my Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures… article, linked above.
    It is my opinion that Louis meant what he so clearly said. Christ will hold you “no matter what.”
    If He said something to the contrary, please let me know.
    Jeff Fenske

  18. Hi.
    I found your Web Site by Google
    And I wish you the best you can get,
    the peace of God through Jesus Christ.
    Welcome to visit my Site.
    Allan Svensson, Sweden
    Surely you have heard the locution: Once saved, always saved.
    It means that when we once received Jesus as our Lord and
    Saviour and are born again, then we can never fall away from
    the Lord. This is a false doctrine that leads to falling away.
    The doctrine of election, which William M. Branham preached,
    that the elected cannot fall away from the Lord, it can entice
    them into a false safety, which can be their fall. Branham’s
    doctrine of the election does not agree with Ezekiel 33:12-19
    or Rom. 11:17-22.
    If the elected ones cannot become lost, why then are there
    so many warnings in the Bible? Why did Jesus warn us about
    false teachers and false prophets, if it is impossible that the
    elected ones become lost? How can you know if you are one
    of the elected, according to Branham’s doctrine?
    If it is no risk to lose our salvation, then we do not need to
    hold us awake or be careful against false teachers. Why then
    are Israel’s sins and punishments under their wandering
    through the desert, written down as warnings for us? Why
    then did Paul write, “Now all these things happened unto
    them for examples: and they are written for our admonition,
    upon whom the ends of the world are coming. Wherefore
    let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he falls.”
    1 Cor. 10:1-12.
    A usual reason that Christians fall away from the Lord, is
    that they follow false doctrines, which lead away from the
    sincere faithfulness to the Lord. They have a fancy to
    doctrines of denominations and church traditions, and these
    have been more important to them than the Bible. They are
    so practised with the lukewarm church atmosphere and think
    it is the normality. Nevertheless, the one who loves the truth
    and has an honest longing to be free from the religious
    harlot-being, being free is possible.
    Our wrestling is not against flesh and blood, but against the
    rulers, against the authorities, against the world rulers of the
    darkness of this age, against the spiritual powers of evil in
    the heaven lies. Eph. 6:10-18. (KJ3). If we are confused of a
    false doctrine, then we can expose it, through to study God’s
    word and pray to God. Through studies of the Bible and
    praying to God, we can in power of God’s word, overcome
    the evil powers and expose their false doctrines.
    We also have the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, He shall teach
    us all things and shall remind you of all things that Jesus has
    said to us. John 14:26, 16:13. “And the anointing which you
    received from Him abides in you, and you have no need that
    anyone teach you, but the same anointing teaches you
    concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and as He
    taught you, abide in Him.” 1 John 2:27.
    Nevertheless, it is a difference between that fall in sin, and
    to falling away from the Lord. “My little children, these things
    write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have
    an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: And
    he is the propitiation for ous sins.” 1 John 2:1. “If we confess
    our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to
    cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” 1 John 1:9. Nevertheless,
    if we do not repent our sins and do not turn to the Lord or
    pray for forgiveness, then it leads to falling away from the
    We do not know how often we do sins against the Lord.
    Therefore, we cannot pray for forgiveness every time we
    have sinned. Yet, the cleaning of all sins through Jesus’
    blood is continuous cleaning. Else we would never know
    if all our sins are forgiven.
    Therefore, it is important that we trust in Jesus and do not
    follow false doctrines. Do not believe that your membership
    in a church or any denomination can give you forgiveness for
    sins. A church is no mediator between God and you. There is
    only one mediator between God and men, Jesus Christ.
    1 Tim. 2:5.
    To get forgiveness for our sins against God, we must also
    forgive those who have sinned against us. Please, read Matt.
    6:12-15. This is a prayer that Jesus taught his disciples. But
    if we do not forgive, then this prayer is highly dangerous.
    You can pray yourself to hell with this prayer. If we do not
    forgive, and we pray God to forgive in the same way as we
    forgive, that would be no forgiveness. Matt. 18:21-35. We
    can also turn the prayer of the Lord and pray, “Help us
    Father to forgive as you forgive.”
    None be saved by works of the law, Gal. 2:16,
    and none be saved without works of faith. Matt. 7:21-23.
    Prepare you to meet Jesus!
    Evil spirits in the churches
    Why did the Pentecostal Revival take an end?
    What does hinder the Antichrist to appear?
    What is the Restrainer?
    Jesus cannot come today because God’s people are not ready

  19. Jonathan

    What did you do to “earn” or “deserve” salvation?

  20. Jeff Fenske

    Please read my article, Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way, and if you still have questions, please let me know.
    Jeff Fenske

    • Anonymous

      thanks Jeff for the insights. i have recently started searching on how to refute this OSAS & Eternal Security/Salvation doctrine, as it is now being taught in our bible study by one of the leaders, to which I am really very opposed of. but i must be armed as well with the Word of God to be able to prove that what he is teaching the group is wrong/false.
      thank you very much and may God continue to bless you.

  21. Bryce

    “For it is by GRACE you have been saved, through FAITH, and this is not from yourselves, it is the GIFT OF GOD” – Ephesians 2:8
    There is nothing that we can do to earn salvation. It is the gift of God, given to us once we accept THE SON as our Savior. Jesus died on the cross to clean us, and there is nothing that we could ever do after salvation to remove us from Him.
    John 10:28-30 says this ”
    I give them eternal life,
    and they shall never perish;
    no one can snatch them out of my hand.
    My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all;
    no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. I and
    the Father are one.”
    Nothing we can do will lose our salvation, for our sins are forgiven. Past, present and future. God bless you all.

    • Jeff Fenske

      The very passage that you cite as the chief pillar of eternal security is toppled here: The CHIEF PILLAR of Eternal Security (OSAS) Toppled!
      And just five chapters later, Jesus clearly says what happens to those who don’t abide in Him, who don’t love their each other as Jesus did.
      John 15:1-14

      1 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the farmer. 2 Every branch in me that doesn’t bear fruit, he takes away. Every branch that bears fruit, he prunes, that it may bear more fruit. 3 You are already pruned clean because of the word which I have spoken to you. 4 Remain in me, and I in you. As the branch can’t bear fruit by itself, unless it remains in the vine, so neither can you, unless you remain in me. 5 I am the vine. You are the branches. He who remains in me, and I in him, the same bears much fruit, for apart from me you can do nothing. 6 If a man doesn’t remain in me, he is thrown out as a branch, and is withered; and they gather them, throw them into the fire, and they are burned. 7 If you remain in me, and my words remain in you, you will ask whatever you desire, and it will be done for you. 8 “In this is my Father glorified, that you bear much fruit; and so you will be my disciples. 9 Even as the Father has loved me, I also have loved you. Remain in my love. 10 If you keep my commandments, you will remain in my love; even as I have kept my Father’s commandments, and remain in his love. 11 I have spoken these things to you, that my joy may remain in you, and that your joy may be made full. 12 “This is my commandment, that you love one another, even as I have loved you. 13 Greater love has no one than this, that someone lay down his life for his friends. 14 You are my friends, if you do whatever I command you.

      What the Bible really says about who goes to heaven is stated here: Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way
      The meaning of “Grace” (χαρις) in the Bible: It’s not what you think?
      Check it out. The ‘church’ is getting jacked! The deception in the last days will be great.
      Jeff Fenske

  22. Bryce

    To me, all the verses you posted are saying that those who are not saved (live in Him) will be tossed out. Believe what you will. I, however, believe that once I have been saved, the eternal love of my God is just that, eternal, and that He will never let me go.

    • Jeff Fenske

      Right. We must be born-again. That’s the start. Then we have the grace to live in Christ. If we choose not to we’ll be cast into the fire and burned.
      Absolutely! These are Jesus’ words, not mine. But the Devil has reversed what Jesus said, putting the responsibility to abide on Jesus, not us. And clearly this isn’t working.
      And this concept is driven home with song lyrics like “You never let go,” sung over and over…. And K-Love will never play songs that tell the truth about who goes to heaven. This is mind-control programming.
      So we’ve been deceived, and if you want to stay in this deception that’s up to you. We all have free will. That’s your right.
      But I choose to believe what the Bible really says, not in a myth. And I hope many others will choose to actually abide in Christ also, so we be ONE with each other in Him — Jesus’ heart-cry for us in John 17.
      Jeff Fenske

    • Jeff Fenske

      I should also respond with Paul’s words, the man who also said “work out your own salvation with fear and trembling” — words you will never hear on K-Love.
      Paul from Galatians 6, right after he gave the two lists in Galatians 5: those who will not inherit the kingdom of God and those who are really Christ’s.

      7 Don’t be deceived. God is not mocked, for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. 8 For he who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption. But he who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life. 9 Let us not be weary in doing good, for we will reap in due season, if we don’t give up.

      Joe Schimmel mentions many of the “Don’t be deceived” scriptures in this presentation, if you’re interested: Joe Schimmel: The Great Deception—Once Saved, Always Saved.
      And since the Bible prophecies that there will be a great deception in the last days, if we’re in the mainstream we should assume that we very well may be in the great deception. Benjamin Baruch says it this way in Take Heed that No Man Deceive You: “FALSE TEACHERS are actually SPEAKING SPELLS…with the words of their FALSE DOCTRINES”.

      The LORD warned us specifically to “take heed that no man deceive you.” The LORD does not give idle warnings, for the warnings and admonitions of the LORD are themselves prophecy of what would come. The LORD is actually saying: “In the last days, the majority will be deceived, take heed that it doesn’t happen to you!”

      Not only is deception of the church possible, it was prophesied to happen! “For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.”

      It’s wise to do your own homework to see what the Bible really says.
      Jeff Fenske

    • Jeff Fenske

      To those interested:
      Here are examples of totally Biblical songs that K-Love will never play:

      [1978 concert video] Keith Green debunked LUTHER’S FALSE SALVATION DOCTRINE that’s now MAINSTREAM in America. Let’s get it right!

      We’re getting brainwashed, mind-controlled not just by what they play over and over and over — but also by what they don’t play — and by what preachers won’t preach.
      And the mainstream secular media is doing the same thing: programming mainly through repetition (some being outright lies) and omission — just like they did in Nazi Germany.
      Luther’s false salvation doctrine was the main culprit then (which opened the door to fascism), and again is today.
      The main problem in Germany wasn’t Hitler, and the main problem in America isn’t Obama. It’s heretical salvation doctrine that allows the Hitlers, the Bushes (Skull and Bonesmen) and the Obamas to destroy freedom within countries.
      People who have integrity from being in Christ, literally, won’t have lies and deception within. And the Holy Spirit will help them see the lies and deceptions without.
      Let’s be free.

  23. Brittany

    I think all of this stuff is great stuff. I was raised to believe that once saved always saved. But Honestly after reading all of this it just makes me more mad!!! This stuff is the reason why people dont want to become christians WE cant agree on anything!! Do you not realize how many un churched or people that have never heard the gospel come to know the Lord because of the willful and open heart the Louie Giglio has to stand in front of thousands of people, doing what the Bible tells us to??? Matthew 28:19 Says” Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit” So I think that this once saved always saved issue should not become an issue until after we have made everyone Disciples!!! God says spread his word not fight about it!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is why we have so many denominations in this world is because everyone interprets things different. But we should not worry about once saved always saved right now! We should worry about the people who have never even heard the name Jesus!!!!!!

    • Jeff Fenske

      I see what you’re saying. Your motivation is right. But please consider this.
      The main reason that people aren’t interested in becoming Christians is not because they haven’t heard about Jesus. Most people aren’t impressed by Christianity because most ‘Christians’ really aren’t real Christians, mostly because of once-saved-always-saved and “it’s hard to lose one’s salvation.”
      The main thing we should be focusing on in order to win the lost is to become real Christians ourselves. Then the world will know, Jesus said, when we become ONE with each other in Christ (John 17):

      Max Lucado: A Citadel for All Christians —”In his last prayer Jesus prayed that you and I be one. … Could it be that unity is the key to reaching the world for Christ? If unity is the key to evangelism shouldn’t it have precedence in our prayers?”

      Unity is the key to evangelism, not laminin, and once-saved-always-saved is the biggest hindrance to unity.
      And most of those listening to Louie are probably ‘Christians’ who are learning some great things about God while getting their own false doctrine reinforced — which is keeping them from going to heaven, themselves.
      Louie is teaching a false gospel. He’s not teaching real Christianity. God wants disciples. He doesn’t want people to be deceived that they can pray a prayer and then they’ll go to heaven no matter what. This is deception.
      Evangelism isn’t an excuse to teach false doctrine. The ends don’t justify the means. Here, the means and the ends are bad. The ends of false teaching like is mainly still-births, instead of fruit that remains, which is what counts, according to Jesus.
      Louie isn’t teaching the people the truth about what it will cost them if they decide to follow Christ: Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way | Who are the Children of God? He’s giving people a false hope, which is what Satan wants: ‘Christians’ who think they are going to heaven but really aren’t — and the way they live turn people off from becoming real Christians.
      Jeff Fenske

      • PhileoTruth

        Hermeneutically, John 17 was fulfilled in Acts 2– when they were all on one accord in one place for the outpouring of the Holy Spirit. We are not now perpetually awaiting the “oneness” in fulfillment of Jesus’ prayer in John 17. (Please consider my explanation.

        • Jeff Fenske

          For the record, John 17 was also fulfilled in many other revivals throughout church history, some of which I highlight on this site, particularly Azusa Street, the Welsh Revival, and the Asbury Revival 1970.
          In every case, it wasn’t God who stopped them, it was men who drifted away. And they usually start with true repentance, men and women drawing near to God and then He draws near to them, like He said He would in James 4.
          This could also be said of the Great Awakenings. The Third Awakening will happen as William Seymour prophesied, when we draw near to God and get right with each other.
          It’s automatic. God said He would draw to us if we draw near to Him. It’s a guarantee.

          • PhileoTruth

            Thank you for your reply. My caution about your answer that John 17 was fulfilled again (and again) in the revivals of the 1900s is that there is no way that anyone can hermeneutically link those revivals to the words of Jesus. Theologically, it is indeed God’s sovereignty that caused revival. However, the idea of perpetual fulfillments of prophetic statements is a dangerous concept because it naturally lends itself to subjective ascriptions of recent/historical events to prophecies of the Bible that have internal fulfillments (ala Acts 2 fulfilling John 17).
            The safe and appropriate hermeneutic is to recognize that once the Bible has recorded the fulfillment of a prophecy, that’s it! To ascribe additional events as fulfillment to prophecies that have documented fulfillments in the scripture is open to the subjective fanciful conclusion of the person conjecturing a link between the extrabiblical event and the prophecy. Please reconsider your hermeneutic when it comes to identifying prophetic fulfillments. Thank you.

  24. Sheila

    Hi Jeff,
    I have been reading through your articles and I do have a question for you. If osas isn’t truth, then when is it that one has crossed the line and is no longer saved? I mean I know that I sin daily in thought word and deed. I also know that through out the day I am convicted and confessing unto the Lord the sin I know about….however many times a day I sin I do not even know…the sin of omission, etc. What if the Lord should come back for the church and I am in the sin of a bad attitude, does that mean I am left behind? I understand your concern over people who pray a prayer and think they have eternal salvation, but I do not know where that line is you are drawing over sin. Recently I was harboring a grudge against my sister and didn’t realize the plank in my own eye was hanging out sooo far all I could see was her speck. I guess my real question is how far? The bible tells us we can know for certain we are his. I am living in my eternal salvation until the Lord returns. I am thankful his HS shows me through his word and convicts me of sin, but your salvation almost (to me) sounds like it is a works based doctrine and that you cannot really rest in him. I think I would be nervous, almost paranoid if I had to live wondering if I was being good enough each and every day and that if he should return I would go home w/ him. For instance, today I am super duper tired. I read and studied my Bible this morning…I served my husband and son…I could be doing something productive right now instead of online replying….am I in sin? Maybe…maybe cuz I am being slothful…I am still saved? Absolutely! I am resting in the assurance of my salvation. I know that I am a wretched wicked sinner saved by grace. The chief sinner.

  25. Thanks for speaking out against the ‘once saved, always saved’ Movement. I have a blog entry about fearing Elohim, which is what our Creator COMMANDED that all men do. Those of this movement will realize one day that it IS a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the Living Elohim. They tell you to your face that they don’t fear ‘god,’ but instead only ‘revere’ their Creator. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, many of them are not afraid to speak evil of dignities…
    Thanks for listening,

  26. Anonymous

    Your God is a shocker
    i would rather an earthly father with human compassion and love than your horrible excuse of a Loving Heavenly Father!!.
    Your God is conditional and look out if you get it wrong old son!! I can tell you right now you will not make his heavenly rest as just reading this small chat site shows up all sorts of errors, I think your God is for the unthinking a stupid pepole! anyone of a sane mind and half intelligent disposition would find him a disturbing ruthless person, i would rather be a child of Hitler or Osama Bin Laden than your God, Its the dumb self righteous and proud people that love your sort of God, and you need to examin yourself to understand your own conduct here.
    And i am sorry you totally misrepresent the Bible when you attempt to explain things through your rose coloured glasses.
    good luck with your Anti Christ God.

  27. Anonymous

    OH Yes let me give an example of your loving God.
    He creates a sinful imperfect world and expects them to behave perfectly!! yes thats right perfectly!! to make the ultimate perfect decision from and imperfect heart!! carnal man is expected to make an eternal decision on a something he knows nothing about……eternity?
    Are you with me or you been there already?
    its obvious to me you are all missing the real point, and that is that God dosent want PERFECTION!! he never created this world to be PERFECT, he dosent want PERFECTION, he created SIN so that he could show us his love!! he wants you all to miss the mark and delights when you do, whilst on this world, in greek the work SIN means to miss the mark, the facts are all around us so open your eyes!! if it werent so he would have changed it right back when ADAM committed the original sin, so yes we are to be perfect in our imperfection, YOU CAN DO NOTHING WITHOUT GOD even sin, so when Christians get on their high horse and claim this and that and self will and free will its all a load of proud exaltations and self righteous proclamation, their attempt to cosy up to a conditional vengeful father is not a lovely thing at all, quite Anti God if you ask me, and they had better look out cause they might be next.
    Ask God to show you how distasteful your version of Christianity tis to the world and gracefully he may show you, but again it is a difficult thing for a self righteous christian to be told anything.
    ……………….your version of GOD is the author of confusion, and is ANTI CHRIST by decree, he places conditions on the Cross by giving human beings the power of eternal determination, ………….think about this for a sec as this is what you believe
    “A sinful creature with the ability to tell the perfect Savioiur of the world to go take a jump!”
    You say this is gods love to us that he allows us to choose, but I say the opposte, if he did allow us to choose then that is insanity, how on earth or heaven can we decide anything when our hearts are all wicked and above all else who can know it? ALL MEN ARE LIKE SHEEP AND GONE ASTRAY.
    The christian salvation message focuses on fear Hell and torment to shoe horn people into heaven, yet again what quality of life do people have when they have been forced to do something where conditions of hate and torture prevail? is it a true love responce from that subject? Is it a love responce to that subject that a God could create a place called Hell and send a large portion of his creation there for ever to be tortured?
    Hell is the real reason why the world need to be born again yet the christians say otherwise, so lets be open and honest and say it! christians hate talking about it as it fundamentally discredits their gods loving nature and they avoid the subject. So who gave us this evil and sinful heart in the first place? and who created Hell? (Isaiah 45) have a look and see where evil comes from it may surprise you.
    The real evil on earth is from one that seeks to place oneself higher than God, who amongst you does this….. Satan? well of course but what about Christians? ……..oh yes thats right, FREEWILL, christians are all in this camp, they seek to daily and humbly rise up above their God by abiding with God under their own power, if you subscribe to this and you are all in the camp of the anti christ, and you will never know God.
    Your God (not mine) exploits humanity which is befitting a hateful being, in the bible it says for parents not to tempt your children yet your God does this, he is a God that says do what i say not what i do, not a good example of leader or father, give me an earthly father anyday!! at least an earthly father wouldnt burn his naughty kids in a rubbish bin filled with fire and keep them alive forever so he can watch them with his selected few.
    Your God is cruel to his own creation !! he is all the more worse thank the most henious of humankind, he does little to instill love and dependance, what sort of people are happy to serve such a person? ………………think about this for a second, what sort of people would want to serve a task master like this? are you one of these? ………………………….this is why the church is so weak and powerless, they have a fox in the hen house and his name is DECEPTION.

    • You Sir/Ms are right now clearly going to believe what you want to believe whether it’s right or not. You have this right. And just like all of us, you will reap what you have sown.
      My calling is to help real Christianity happen among those who want to participate. When God’s glory is manifest among His people ~”then the world will know” — Jesus’ heart-cry for His people in John 17.
      I pray this happens before you die so this can perhaps help you see what God is really like.
      God is holy. He is just. And He does have a stern side that most preachers totally or almost totally ignore:

      “See then the goodness and severity of God. Toward those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in his goodness; otherwise you also will be cut off.” (Romans 11:22)

      So “God’s people” are just off doing their own thing, not abiding in the Vine, not demonstrating His love towards people. And many are therefore scandalized by those who call themselves ‘Christians,’ but do not follow Christ.
      And God allows this to happen because He does give us free will to do our own thing, but He has been there all of the time to help.
      And now look what’s happening to America and the world as a consequence because the Christians have opened their hearts to sin. And then many blame others; though, God says they are the main ones responsible for the fall of America, no matter what their ‘Christian’ radio and TV says.
      You are probably better off than they are right now, because they are lukewarm. I thought of the scripture in Revelation 3 in which Jesus says:

      “To the angel of the assembly in Laodicea write: “The Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Head of God’s creation, says these things:

      “I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were cold or hot. So, because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will vomit you out of my mouth. Because you say, ‘I am rich, and have gotten riches, and have need of nothing;’ and don’t know that you are the wretched one, miserable, poor, blind, and naked; I counsel you to buy from me gold refined by fire, that you may become rich; and white garments, that you may clothe yourself, and that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and eye salve to anoint your eyes, that you may see. As many as I love, I reprove and chasten. Be zealous therefore, and repent. Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, then I will come in to him, and will dine with him, and he with me. He who overcomes, I will give to him to sit down with me on my throne, as I also overcame, and sat down with my Father on his throne. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the assemblies.”

      Stay tuned…
      ONE can happen! (John 17)
      It will be glorious!

  28. Gold

    Godbless us all!
    God be glorified !

    • The false doctrine of once-saved-always-saved is the biggest cause for compromised Christianity, which is producing many people who call themselves “Christians,” but are not, and they’re turning off the world.
      And I believe the opposite to what you are saying is liketly. Someone standing up for the truth about deception in today’s ‘church’ should give non-Christians hope.
      It’s generally the willfully sinning OSAS ‘Christians’ that are bothered by this post, not non-Christians.
      Also, I have almost 1,000 posts on this site, which you are welcome to read in order to get a bigger picture of where I’m coming from. A good place to start might be Jeff’s Writings.
      The truth is that most ‘Christians’ aren’t going-to-heaven Christians. The deception in these last days is so great.
      Jesus will spit the lukewarm out of His mouth regardless of whether they’ve been born-again or not:

      Kevin Conner on the Believer’s CONDITIONAL Security: “OBEDIENCE IS the very law of SECURITY for all created beings. There can be NO SUCH THING as UNCONDITIONAL security.”

      Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way |
      Who are the Children of God?

      There is a reason America is going down, and it’s because of the ‘Christians’ who aren’t really salt and light, but instead act like repellents.
      This site is aimed towards Christians, so we can get our act together and really be Christians together in Christ — “that the world will know” — Jesus said in John 17.
      Let’s be real.

  29. Anonymous

    Your argument concerning “once saved, always saved” has one major problem – it relies on your own interpretation of a few specific verses and your own web pages. If your god is so small that he can’t hold onto those who have obeyed him, then could I please introduce you to my God who is great and from whose hand no one pluck me.

  30. Anonymous

    Unfortunately and sadly this article is false doctrine. Once a person in born again they can never lose their salvation. Again we see that for some reason people just can’t grasp the Biblical truth that
    salvation has nothing to do with our works. It is grace alone through faith in Christ. By saying that you can lose your salvation you are saying that you are the one who made it to heaven because of your good works,
    as if any of us are good enough to enter a holy heaven. It is also saying that Christ’s saving work on the cross was not good enough, that He has to be re-crucified whenever we stray. It’s sad to see people who
    believe they can lose their salvation because how do they know they are save in the end. In the end the truly saved people will endure to the end and will be faithful because they have the Holy Spirit in them to help
    them do so. It has nothing to do with our works.

    • I wonder if ANYONE here has ever really studied for themselves what the Bible really says about who goes to heaven. Or are you all just believing what you’ve been taught.
      Someday, you’ll stand before Christ, Himself, and you will be judged based upon what is really true, not what you’ve been taught. And some, like myself tried to tell you….
      Most pastors, themselves just teach what they have been taught. They keep passing on the lie. And most don’t want to even look at what I’ve written.
      There is a lot of pride and presumption in the body of Christ, which is mostly not pure enough to be truly part of His body.
      Most people are just riding the big and popular boat to eternal destruction — not getting right with those they’ve hurt — and not loving God with all of their heart, soul, mind and strength either — on the eve of destruction — while Jesus waits with tears in His eyes for His people to get on their knees and repent.
      How far must America fall before the people are willing to admit they could have been wrong about key doctrines like this? Don’t you realize that God has been trying to get your attention, but you wouldn’t listen. Now you will be judged. All of us will lose our country. We had our chance.

  31. Anonymous

    I appreciate how you reply to everyone that comments. You don’t see that a lot.
    The one thing I have always wondered about people who believe you can lose your salvation is this:
    In the end, how do you know you have done enough or that you are living enough for Christ?
    It just seems that those people would have to think to themselves that they have done and are doing
    a good enough job of living for Christ. That tells me that 1.) The people think they deserve heaven.
    2.) They think their works are what help them get there. And 3.) That those people are being rather
    prideful, which is sin, so that would cancel out 1 and 2 right? Those are just some areas that I have
    always be curious about when it come to the belief that you can lose your salvation.

    • Anonymous

      Dear Sir/Ms.,
      Have you read the scriptures that I put together: Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way | Who are the Children of God?
      Look especially at what I show about Galatians 5 and Romans 8. And then 1 John sums it up. We must abide in Him, and really abide. Becoming born-again is just the start.
      Sadly, most ‘Christians’ aren’t really going-to-heaven Christians according to what the Bible really teaches.
      The good news is that when people really do understand what is required, and then live that way, then revival, The Third Great Awakening can really happen. And that will be glorious!
      Mainly, it’s about right relationships. If our conscience isn’t clear before God now, imagine how we’ll feel when we see Him face to face! We must be clean to enter, as the Holy Spirit enables us to overcome. And overcome we must.
      Jesus said there will be no cowards in heaven, so there is something to doing what He’s called us to do: “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of Heaven; but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.”
      Paul wanted the people to be like the Bereans, to study to make sure that what they have been taught is true. How many pastors encourage the people to study who goes to heaven? How many pastors have even studied it themselves?
      We need to see what the Bible really says. We shouldn’t trust the mainstream media these days to tell us the truth about what is going on in the world, and we shouldn’t trust most pastors, right now, either. There is some serious deception going on. It’s like we’re living in the Matrix, and we need to be willing to take the red pill, to fully live in reality no matter what it is.
      Hell for all eternity is an awful price to pay for not being vigilant now. And life is so much more alive and full when we’re living in Christ.
      We need to do the greatest two commandments, which have replaced the law. We need to walk in love. Now is our chance. This is our proving ground. And the joy of the Lord is supposed to be our strength — walking together in Love, Himself — filled with the Holy Spirit!
      Satan’s temptations these days are probably the strongest ever, especially because they’re so accessible, thanks to the internet and videos. But that is no excuse. The ‘Christians’ have allowed the fall of decency to happen, even participating in it themselves. We need to find a way to live above the fray — living in the world, but not a part of it. We must be light.
      1 John:

      2:28 Now, little children, remain in him, that when he appears, we may have boldness, and not be ashamed before him at his coming.

      4:16 We know and have believed the love which God has for us. God is love, and he who remains in love remains in God, and God remains in him. 17 In this, love has been made perfect among us, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment, because as he is, even so are we in this world.

      This isn’t a game or a mathematical formula. It’s about real relationship with God and right relationships with each other.
      This is deadly serious. We need to figure this out now, and live accordingly, to not be drunk with wine (trying to get our highs from the world) but be filled with the Holy Spirit!
      It’s a win-win. The enticements in this world don’t really satisfy, now, and we must avoid hell at all costs!

  32. Anonymous

    I don’t mean to be rude, but this still just seems like you are saying we can earn our salvation. Ephesians 2:89. No man can boast.
    It also seems like you are saying that if Christians believe in eternal security then they are going to hell. I know many Christians
    who believe in eternal security who live just the way you outlined above. In the end it all comes down to Christ. It seems like you think
    that those Christians who believe in eternal security just don’t care or have the desire to live in Christ. That could not be farther from the truth.
    Again in the end if you are Born again and have Christ as your savior then you are eternally secure. If you need the idea of being able to lose
    your salvation to motivate you to live for Christ then that is your thing. As the Bible says, you will know the true Christians by their fruit.
    If you are truly saved then you can’t help but live for Christ and those are the ones that the Bible speaks about when it says that those who endure till
    the end will be saved. Thank you for your reply above. Again I hope I did not offend you with any of my comments, that is not my intention.

    • What you are saying isn’t offensive to me, but it does seem to indicate that you still haven’t carefully read the scriptures in my article Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way | Who are the Children of God?
      God sets the rules, and not me. I’m just a spokesman.
      What are you going by in your argumentation: what you’ve been taught the Bible says, or what the Bible really says?
      This is what gets frustrating to me, when people try to tell me where it’s at but haven’t carefully studied what the Bible really says.
      This is the most important subject, yet hardly anyone will study to make sure. Why is that? Because many have religious spirits in them that, people praying (James-3 cursing) that they’ll believe the established doctrine without question.
      Have you ever thought of that, that you could have evil spirits compelling you to accept the once-saved-always-saved doctrine of demons?
      Why else are the majority so skiddish to even find out what the Bible really says and what the Holy Spirit is saying to the church?
      The Devil doesn’t want you to know for sure. So do the opposite of what he wants.
      Study to make sure.
      I just posted this, by the way: [Reality-check video] Learn Why Jesus BANNED Heaven From Famous Uganda Pastor!

  33. Anonymous

    Well pharisees sadducees etc n even satan knew the bible well n satan even knows god well x arguing and criticising gods chosen speakers is not loving or helpful x

  34. Paula

    Earth be in perfect alignment with the Sun but the Sun and Earth will also be in perfect alignment with the center of The Milky Way Galaxy. Besides this happing very rarely and not knowing what could happen to the planet there is another factor. Scientists have found in the last five or six years what the Mayans discovered thousands of years ago , a black hole in the center of The Milky Way Galaxy. How does that Cross line up with the earth, sun and center of the Milky Way Galaxy on September 21st. That is the date when the Earth, the Sun and the center of the Milky Way Galaxy are supposed to line up.
    from Paula in China

  35. Anonymous

    I don’t know when you heard Louie say that once saved always saved. But when he brought up the millions of crosses holding us together, he meant that when ever we have troubles in our Christian life (and we will) Christ will always be by our side. Salvation has nothing to do with the message.

    • You say: “I don’t know when you heard Louie say….”
      I carefully transcribed exactly what Louie said in my post, above — which is typical ‘once saved, always saved’ doctrine — the exact opposite of what Jesus taught.

  36. Anonymous

    Most of your responses contain an awful lot of “I” and “My”. Just saying.

  37. Sammy W Funderburk Jr

    Is there any way that I could receive a copy of How Great Is Our God.
    I don’t want sell it, it was so great that I would like to show it the Bible Study that I’m in

  38. Robert G

    You need to clarify and if you disagree with this well we will pray for you but i think this presentation was incredible

  39. Tineka Nunes

    Hi there, why make things complicated! This DVD may well save someone’s life and bring them to salvation. It really made me re-look at our Father again and reminded me of who and what He really is. The part of the DVD that you have ‘dissected’ is merely your opinion, and I can see and understand where you are coming. However, in my opinion, Louie is trying and explaining just how much God loves us. It’s not about how much you love God but how much He loves each and every one of us unconditionally. We are His creation, His children, and He loves us and yearns for us to love Him back. That’s why He made us, to bring Him glory and to love Him. This is our purpose in life, and it’s scriptual. This, I think, is the message Louis was sending out to the world and he did a phenomenal job. God bless you Louie

    • Tineka,
      A Christian friend suggested I watch this. He was all enthusiastic about it. I did find it interesting, but when I saw Louie teaching the once-saved-always-saved deception I knew I needed to warn people about Louie’s pushing of this false doctrine, this lie from Satan that is sending many to hell, thinking they are going to heaven, and giving many the excuse not to press in, so they are holy and bear fruit that remains — fruit that could have saved America. Now, it’s too late.
      The Grammys just showed how far America has fallen, and this is all possible because most ‘Christians’ are also worshiping the creation instead of the Creator (Romans 1); though, the opposite, not same-sex. The Christians’ willful sinning has destroyed America:

      The Red Gate Prophecy — What If I Open It Just a Little Bit? The believers, not the non-believers, have opened the gate to sin, which is why this country has deteriorated

      I’m not discounting the laminin message, but because the message is so powerful, when Louie throws in the OSAS deception, many will swallow that too, hook, line and sinker.
      Those who are teaching OSAS are teaching another gospel. It’s not “merely my opinion.” It’s fact, which you will see if you actually take the time to read what the Bible really says about who goes to heaven, before you lose your own salvation, if you are willfully sinning and not abiding in the Vine, the place of safety in the heart of God. The deception in the last days is this great:

      Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way | Who are the Children of God? — “There is therefore now *no condemnation* to those who are IN CHRIST Jesus, who don’t WALK according to the flesh, but ACCORDING TO THE SPIRIT.”

      Jesus promised to give us His glory so we’d be ‘ONE’ with each other in Him, “that the world will know.”
      Most people are turned off by the willfully sinning, not-abiding-in-Him church. Most are not going to become Christians watching a DVD. But many will when ‘ONE’ happens. And OSAS is keeping ‘ONE’ from happening.
      So if we really care about people becoming real Christians so they can go to heaven we’ll be alarmed when we hear OSAS being pushed down people’s throats just about everywhere you look, including K-LOVE.
      The grace changers have put many to sleep, convincing many that they can never lose their salvation even when they willfully and knowingly sin without repenting and getting right with those they’ve hurt. This is a different gospel that has even now spread to the underground church in China, putting them to sleep, spiritually too.
      This is very serious, and America needs to repent from believing in and spreading this false gospel — not having made sure in the Scriptures that what they’re being taught is true, like the “more noble” Bereans did with Paul.
      When we see Jesus face to Face, we won’t be able to say: “but Louie said,” or Matt Redman sang “Never Let Go” thousands of times on K-LOVE — the opposite of what Jesus said in John 15.
      Our hearts must be clean, now, so they’ll be clean then, and we won’t be ashamed and horrified….
      The grace changers say: “no,” it’s about what Jesus did. But accepting what Jesus did is just the start of our life of living for and in Christ. Only the overcomers will not have their names removed from the Book of Life and not be spit out of Christ’s mouth – Rev. 3.
      We need to be like the Bereans, and not accept the false gospel just because it feels good and everyone else seems to be loving it too.
      That’s why we’re in the trouble we’re in. Not enough Bereans making sure….
      The New Testament is crystal clear. “Those who are led by the Spirit are the children of God.” “Those who belong to Christ have crucified the flesh with its passions and lusts.”
      We must actually follow Christ to be real Christians, like Paul made sure he did:

      “I also practice always having a conscience void of offense toward God and men.” (Acts 24:16)

      When God shows up, because a group of people somewhere decided to actually follow Christ, then we’re going to see many become real Christians, because then the world will know.
      Learning about laminin is nice, but the Third Great Awakening happening in our midst, that will be the major game changer.
      To be free,

      • Anonymous

        Hi Jeff,
        Thank-you for your reply.
        It makes for some interesting reading, and how true it all it, I agree 100%
        A question for you; If I am baptized in water (completely submerged), and accept Jesus into my heart as Lord and saviour (in South Africa we spell it saviour) and the true sovereign and living God, surely I am saved. However, if I sin afterwards and repent, and then sin again and then repent again, surely I am still saved. Therefore Once-saved-always-saved then kicks in right? Because spiritually I will forever be saved, but if my soul is not right with God ALL THE TIME then I stand a pretty good chance of not being saved, unless of course I repent.
        So, that’s how OSAS is pretty much true, I think!! And those who are spiritually mature and watch the DVD, will probably interpret it that way too, like I did.
        Just a thought…
        What is the Third Great Awakening?
        free indeed,

        • Tineka,
          There are two problems with this idea. First, what happens if we die while willfully sinning, rebelling against our Saviour, before we repent?
          And most born-again ‘Christians’ don’t seem to be fully repenting. They’re into repeatance, instead of repentance.
          Many don’t even remember what it’s like to feel scary condemnation from willfully sinning (“There is therefore now *no condemnation* to those who are IN CHRIST Jesus, who don’t WALK according to the flesh, but ACCORDING TO THE SPIRIT”), because they’ve put off repenting so long that the Holy Spirit backs off, because the people don’t want to hear the truth once they get on the sin road without ever getting completely off again. The Holy Spirit won’t keep on bugging them; though, deep down they still won’t feel right. Many seem to always have to have something going, like having the radio or something on, because when it’s totally quiet they won’t feel right.
          When they see Jesus face to Face “not feeling right” will become terror!
          Few, including pastors, seem to be getting right with those they’ve hurt too. Most pastors are mostly disqualified to lead, based upon Paul’s elders’ qualifications that they must be “blameless.”

          Paul’s Elders’ qualifications revisited: What does ‘BLAMELESS’ mean? — Most pastors are biblically disqualified

          The truth is that only about 2% of the people are going to heaven:

          How Many Will Be in Heaven? How Many Find the WAY? Only 1 in 40 — 2.5%!?!!

          I don’t remember hearing much ‘Christian’ radio when I spent a few weeks in South Africa two decades ago. In America in the ’70s, Christian radio was excellent, but then the secular record companies bought the Christian record labels out.
          And we now have this station called K-LOVE that has repeaters everywhere, whose goal is to make soccer moms feel right about their lives even if they don’t feel right, from willfully sinning and not fully repenting.
          They play “Never Let Go” over and over, and last I tuned in they were mentioning Romans 8:1a pretty much every hour. It’s basically mind-control, brainwashing programming, 24/7.

  40. I don’t support the doctrine of “once saved always saved,” or any other variation or label thereof. We are COMMANDED to not “revere” Elohim, but to FEAR and DREAD Him (I wrote an article about it). To this end I have written an article about my research that shows that there shall indeed be an upcoming, epic War on Christmas, with my article is entitled, ‘Why is Christianity Beholden to Babylonian Holidays of Christmas and Easter (Mythology)? Follow the Mammon, Follow the Great Whore and Become Little Spiritual Whores? “Come Out From Among Them And Be Ye Separate, Says YHWH”‘ Further research shows that the original disciples of the Way of the Jewish Messiah were NEVER, EVER told or taught to be “holy,” or to achieve “holiness” or “godliness,” but, INSTEAD, were COMMANDED to be set-apart as Set-Apart Ones to achieve set-apartness through the Set-Apart Spirit of Elohim, BECAUSE Elohim is set-apart. Pleas just type 777denny into any search engine later to find the article and critique as needed.Thank you for your time — and for listening! 777denny 🙂

  41. alicia

    Thank you for all your research. I understand how frustrating it can be to try to explain the truth to everyone, especially when it is not the popular doctrine being taught. Sometimes I wonder why I even bother considering I get persecuted daily. But seeing how you are persevering and responding in a manner that reflects Christ, encourages me. When I read the bible I forget all I was taught and take it for what it is without trying to overcomplicate it. That is how I came to find out you aren’t once saved always saved and there won’t be a pre trib rapture. I think it lays it out plainly for us. Anyways the bible teaches we will no longer need someone to teach the meaning to us, but that will will know the word and it will be in our heart. So why is it so many insist on complicated explanations? Anyways, keep up the good work and if anything God will reward you for your perseverance!

    • Alicia,
      I’m very glad you’re encouraged — and thanks for encouraging me too!
      It can be discouraging to swim upstream day after day without seeing immediate fruit, especially when some of those who are swimming the other way, and even getting in our face are former Christian friends who are swallowing the lies. They’re supposed to be part of the solution. What’s up? How could it get this bad so fast? So frustrating!
      But the Devil is inspiring them. He’s driving their sin, and implanting ideas. They don’t really know how this works, or don’t want to admit their rebellion is demon driven, because demons speak in the first person, as if they’re are own voice. So if they don’t really know what they’re doing, this should make it easier to forgive them, like Jesus did. But it’s still hard.
      The Devil has worked extremely hard on them, and he’s extremely hostile against those who keep on teaching the truth and expose his lies. He works extra hard to keep God’s people down.
      We must keep our eyes set like Paul did, and not give into his pressure to conform to his evil and just shut up. We need to take a stand and be holy, regardless of what everyone else seems to be doing. “No Compromise” — Keith Green!!
      I’m convinced a major revival will take place, which will be AWESOME. That’s my passion — like we’ve never seen before — and will continue, unlike other revivals, because we’ll make sure to keep holy — knowing that without holiness no one will see the Lord. We can’t be Christians unless we’re following Christ. It’s part of the definition of the word Christian. It really is simple. If we’re not following Christ we’re not Christians — no matter what Charles Stanley says.
      I really do think it’s simple, but few want to admit the way is as narrow as Jesus and the other New Testament authors clearly said.
      If our consciences aren’t clear now — if we don’t feel right with God in our hearts now we’re not going to feel right when we see Jesus face to Face!

      No Condemnation now so No Condemnation when we meet Jesus face to Face — Hearts pure, smiling so big!!! FREEeeeeeeee———–DOM!!!!!!!

      It’s that simple, and we may not have many years left before we see the end of America. It’s time to obey now, and when enough are we’ll be in a flow of the Holy Spirit that will be the greatest forward momentum we’ve ever experienced, I believe. I’ve been longing to experience this for decades, having had some foretastes of what it should be like, life in the Son, together as ‘ONE.’ It only takes a few people, somewhere, to get this going — people who are right with each other in Him, “that the world will know”:

      ‘Let Us Be ONE’ Prophecy Continues 10/8/08: “It’s TOO LATE to REVERSE what’s been done for MY MEN have been REJECTED … Now is the Time to OVERCOME and GET RIGHT With ALL … FREEeeeeeeeeeeeee———DOM at last … Your HEART will SWELL with LOVE and it will be EASY to REMAIN In Me when others are On The BOAT With You”

      “…that the world will know” (John 17). People have a right to see the real thing:

      Rethinking Matthew 24: “…then the end will come” — after the Pete Townshends “know”?

      Power to the Peaceful!!!

  42. Cheryl

    I truly enjoy Louie and his sermons and not once have I thought he taught that you can “say a prayer and become a christian and keep living in the flesh and you will go to Heaven and I have watched several of his sermons over the years.
    Once you have truly committed yourself to Jesus and his death on the cross for you, you are saved. Period.
    Not once Have I heard Louie say, you can keep on willfully sinning and go to heaven,
    It is a “heart issue” and only the great I AM, the Alpha and Omega knows your heart and what your true intent of your confession is.
    Once your name is in the book of life< it is there and will not be blotted out (unless you deny the holy spirit which is the unforgivable sin)
    Many folks sadly say a confessional prayer accepting Jesus but they do not live for him after that, they continue to live in their flesh.. When you truly love Jesus you do not want to keep sinning, you submit to his authority and you want to become more like him (less of me, more of him)
    King James Bible
    And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
    Revelation 3:5
    The one who is victorious will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out the name of that person from the book of life, but will acknowledge that name before my Father and his angels.

    • Here is an excerpt from my article in which I discuss what Jesus said about the Book of Life:
      Who-Goes-To-Heaven Scriptures — Narrow is the Way | Who are the Children of God? — “There is therefore now *no condemnation* to those who are IN CHRIST Jesus, who don’t WALK according to the flesh, but ACCORDING TO THE SPIRIT”
      Here is Jesus’ rarely taught statement that says so much about who goes to heaven. The assembly in Sardis actually had a reputation for being alive. How many ‘churches’ in America can say that today? But most of the ‘Christians’ in Sardis were in danger of losing their salvation because Jesus hadn’t found their “works perfected.” But some had:
      Yet only the “few names in Sardis that did not defile their garments” were truly walking with Christ, “for they are worthy.” Jesus only told those who overcame, who were therefore dressed in white, that their names would not be blotted out from the Book of Life.
      Revelation 3

      1 “And to the angel of the assembly in Sardis write: He who has the seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars says these things: “I know your works, that you have a reputation of being alive, but you are dead. 2 Wake up, and keep the things that remain, which you were about to throw away, for I have found no works of yours perfected beforeGod. 3 Remember therefore how you have received and heard. Keep it, and repent. If therefore you won’t watch, I will come as a thief, and you won’t know what hour I will come upon you. 4 Nevertheless you have a few names in Sardis that did not defile their garments. They will walk with me in white, for they are worthy. 5 He who overcomes will be arrayed in white garments, and I will in no way blot his name out of the book of life, and I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.


      Jesus continues His thought in the famous Laodicean lukewarm passage, that is actually talking about salvation: “I will vomit you out of my mouth.” We need to overcome as Jesus overcame (verse 21), abiding in Him (verse 20).
      The white garment theme from verse 5 is repeated. And “vomit you out of my mouth” seems to be another way of saying “blot his name out of the book of life,” also in verse 5:

      Blot his name out of the book of life (v. 5)


      Vomit you out of my mouth (v. 16)

      14 “To the angel of the assembly in Laodicea write: “The Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Head of God’s creation, says these things:

      15 “I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were cold or hot. 16 So, because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will vomit you out of my mouth. 17 Because you say, ‘I am rich, and have gotten riches, and have need of nothing;’ and don’t know that you are the wretched one, miserable, poor, blind, and naked; 18 I counsel you to buy from me gold refined by fire, that you may become rich; and white garments, that you may clothe yourself, and that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and eye salve to anoint your eyes, that you may see. 19 As many as I love, I reprove and chasten. Be zealous therefore, and repent. 20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, then I will come in to him, and will dine with him, and he with me. 21 He who overcomes, I will give to him to sit down with me on my throne, as I also overcame, and sat down with my Father on his throne. 22 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the assemblies.”

      Francis Chan explains it this way:

  43. Cheryl

    I stumbled upon your blog last night and left above comment (9/6/15 at 9:26pm). This morning my devotional said this:
    ———————A famous Christian leader insisted that anyone could lose his salvation. I asked him if he felt that he would ever lose his, Quickly, he replied “Absolutely not. I am sure I will not lose my salvation.”
    I believe there is too much controversy over this issue. Some fear those who have assurance of salvation and know they will spend eternity with God might tend to compromise their conduct, resulting in disobedience to God and insulting Christ and His Church. Others think those who do not live like Christians have never experienced new birth, do not have eternal life and will be forever separated from God.
    It is quite likely that the person who insists on “doing his own thing” — going his own way while professing to be a Christian– is deceived and should be encouraged to look to the mirror of God’s Word. For if his salvation is real, the evidence should proclaim it.
    The Caterpillar that goes through metamorphosis to become a butterfly lives like a butterfly, not a caterpillar. In the same way, the man who has experienced new life in Christ will witness to it in their life.
    Today’s Scripture deals with seven marvelous truths.
    1) He chose us
    2) He called us
    3) we came
    4) He declared us not guilty
    5) He filled us with Christ’s goodness
    6) He gave us right standing
    7) He promised us His glory
    One famous theologian put it this way: “How would it be a source of consolation to say… that whom God foreknew, He predesignated, and whom He predesignated, He called, and whom He called, He justified and whom He justified might fall away and be lost forever?”
    We should praise and worship God because of His promises to all who receive Him, that He will never leave nor forsake them (Hebrews 13:5)

    • Ken

      These indeed are wonderful promises for the faithful. Another theologian, perhaps less popular than the one you quote, but one to whom should be given more credence, said this:
      For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them. It has happened to them according to the true proverb, “A dog returns to its own vomit,” and, “A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire.”

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